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Attuarii
Guest
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 Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
 |
|
I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it would
provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI domination. The
more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize it is anything but
that. I have recently been investigating the Scottish Rite.
This is one tidbit others might find interesting.
<quote>
http://www.scottishritecalifornia.org/founding_fathers.htm
As we consider the beginnings of the Scottish Rite, we must wonder also
about these eleven men who took it upon themselves to formalize a Supreme
Council. What were their names, where did they come from, and what
happened later in their lives? Of course, there isn't time to delve very
far into those matters at this time. But, I do want to list their names
with a few facts as follows:
bullet
JOHN MITCHELL - Received a patent April 2 1795, from Barend Moses Spitzer
granting him authority as Deputy Inspector General to create a Lodge of
Perfection and several Councils and Chapters wherever such Lodges or
Chapters were needed.
Born in Ireland in l741, he came to America at an early age, was Deputy
Quartermaster General in the Continental Army, and the first Grand
Commander of the Supreme Council.
bullet
FREDERICK DALCHO - A physician. He served in the Army and for a while was
stationed at Fort Johnson. He formed a partnership with Dr. Isaac Auld,
another of the original members, in 1801. He was an outstanding orator and
author. In 1807 he published the 1st Edition of Ahiman Rezon. He became
an editor of the Charleston Courier, was a lay reader and deacon in the
Episcopal Church and in 1818 was ordained a Priest.
bullet
ALEXANDER FRANCOIS AUGUSTE deGRASSE TILLY - A son of a French Admiral, and
perhaps the most famously connected of all the original eleven. He was the
youngest of the members and was named to become the Grand Commander of the
West Indian Islands. He later moved to France and established the Supreme
Council of France.
bullet
JEAN BAPTISTE MARIE DeLAHOGUE - He was a native of Paris and was a member of
LaCandeur Lodge in Charleston.
bullet
THOMAS BARTHOLOMEW BOWEN - Was the first Grand Master of Ceremonies of the
new Supreme Council. He was a Major in the Continental Army and a printer
by trade.
bullet
ABRAHAM ALEXANDER - Was one of the first Sovereign Grand Inspectors General.
He was born in London in 1743, immigrated to Charleston in 1771. He was a
very prominent Jew and had been described as "a Calligraphist of the first
order," which may account for his election as the first Grand Secretary
General.
bullet
EMANUEL DE LA MATTA - A Sovereign Grand Inspector General. He was by trade
a merchant and auctioneer. He was a member of Friendship Lodge and was
reported to be quite devoted to the study of Jewish Literature and Masonic
Study.
bullet
ISAAC AULD - An eminent physician, associated in medical practice with Dr.
Dalcho. He was a rigid Congregationalist.
bullet
ISRAEL DE LIEBEN - A Sovereign Grand Inspector General and the first Grand
Treasurer General. He was born in Prague and emigrated to America upon
reaching Majority age. He was known as "the liberal-headed Jew," who
was "tolerant in his religious opinions and was considered to be
intelligent, enterprising, liberal and generous.
bullet
MOSES CLAVA LEVY - Was born in Krakow, Poland. He was a prosperous
merchant, was generous and helpful to the unfortunate and devoted to his
adopted city and country.
bullet
JAMES MOULTRIE - Was the only native South Carolinian among the original
members. He was a Doctor of Medicine, and according to Albert Pike, "was
one of the foremost Citizens of South Carolina."
Back to Top
Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews, two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By profession
they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?" It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
</quote>
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno |
|
| |
|
 Back to top |
Doug Freyburger
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
| Quote: |
I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it would
provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI domination. The
more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize it is anything but
that.
|
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
| Quote: | Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews,
|
That's a hot topic for you. It has little relevance in an Asatru
context - Judaism is a folkish faith that happens to be
monotheist. Important to learn from if you have folkish
inclinations but largely ignored by those who do have folksih
inclinations.
| Quote: | two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By profession
they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?"
|
For that era of low diversity compared to today, that was an
extremely varied group so it does demonstrate Masonic
tolerance and lack of discrimination on a scale that beats
almost anything else available in that era.
| Quote: | It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
/quote
|
Yep. That's another of your interests that doesn't matter on
ARA. |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Doug Freyburger
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
| Quote: | Doug Freyburger wrote:
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
Sure are a lot of lions of Judea, Hebrew inscriptions from the Bible, Keys
of Solomon, etc.
|
All of us live in a world packed with JCI symbols and
writings yet we manage to decide to be Asatru. Funny
how that fact doesn't occur to you in your conspiracy
theory rantings.
| Quote: | Actually, I posted here because you are SR, and I think others should know
what that means.
|
Sure. Freedom of religion. Living a self inspected life.
Plenty of stuff present in Asatru but missing in
Christianity. A bit redundant with attending Kindred
meetings.
| Quote: | ... When the guy at the Supreme Council explained
the political structure as authoritarian and autocratic, I realized for
certain that I was in the wrong place.
|
Yup. No kings in ancient Asatru, no sirree. No class
structure either. Chortle.
| Quote: | Stop trying to tell me what to do here.
|
Stop osting your lunacy. Asatru is too small to have
someone like you out in public making a bad name for
the rest of us.
| Quote: | Go back to your protected domain if you want to boss people around.
|
Have fun with your lunacy. |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Attuarii
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:50 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Doug Freyburger wrote:
| Quote: | Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it
would provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI
domination. The more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize it
is anything but that.
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
|
Sure are a lot of lions of Judea, Hebrew inscriptions from the Bible, Keys
of Solomon, etc.
| Quote: | Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews,
That's a hot topic for you. It has little relevance in an Asatru
context - Judaism is a folkish faith that happens to be
monotheist. Important to learn from if you have folkish
inclinations but largely ignored by those who do have folksih
inclinations.
|
Actually, I posted here because you are SR, and I think others should know
what that means.
| Quote: | two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By profession
they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?"
For that era of low diversity compared to today, that was an
extremely varied group so it does demonstrate Masonic
tolerance and lack of discrimination on a scale that beats
almost anything else available in that era.
It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
/quote
Yep. That's another of your interests that doesn't matter on
ARA.
|
That was the clincher for me. When the guy at the Supreme Council explained
the political structure as authoritarian and autocratic, I realized for
certain that I was in the wrong place. Stop trying to tell me what to do
here. Go back to your protected domain if you want to boss people around.
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Attuarii
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:13 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Doug Freyburger wrote:
| Quote: | Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
Sure are a lot of lions of Judea, Hebrew inscriptions from the Bible,
Keys of Solomon, etc.
All of us live in a world packed with JCI symbols and
writings yet we manage to decide to be Asatru.
|
I've managed pretty well to avoid most of it.
| Quote: | Funny
how that fact doesn't occur to you in your conspiracy
theory rantings.
|
It's like I said to Steny Hoyer's chief of staff when he told me there was
no conspiracy behind the 9/11 attacks, verbatim, 'Are you fucking psycho?
Four commercial jets do not spontaneously go off course simultaneously and
slam into buildings or explode in mid air (as did UAL 93)'.
| Quote: | Actually, I posted here because you are SR, and I think others should
know what that means.
Sure. Freedom of religion. Living a self inspected life.
Plenty of stuff present in Asatru but missing in
Christianity. A bit redundant with attending Kindred
meetings.
... When the guy at the Supreme Council explained
the political structure as authoritarian and autocratic, I realized for
certain that I was in the wrong place.
Yup. No kings in ancient Asatru, no sirree. No class
structure either. Chortle.
|
The Germanic people were quite a variegated lot with many different
political structures. I know of no evidence of widespread rigidly
authoritarian hierarchies among the ancient Germani.
| Quote: | Stop trying to tell me what to do here.
Stop osting your lunacy. Asatru is too small to have
someone like you out in public making a bad name for
the rest of us.
|
I have not been discussing my own situation in this thread. Strange that
you should view it as such.
| Quote: | Go back to your protected domain if you want to boss people around.
Have fun with your lunacy.
|
I had to laugh when I was doing my investigation into Freemasionry and
decided to ask the perennial "Where was Heinz?"
http://www.google.com/search?q=Henry+Kissinger+Propaganda+Due
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:22 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Attuarii wrote:
| Quote: | Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it
would provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI
domination. The more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize it
is anything but that.
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
Sure are a lot of lions of Judea, Hebrew inscriptions from the Bible, Keys
of Solomon, etc.
Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews,
That's a hot topic for you. It has little relevance in an Asatru
context - Judaism is a folkish faith that happens to be
monotheist. Important to learn from if you have folkish
inclinations but largely ignored by those who do have folksih
inclinations.
Actually, I posted here because you are SR, and I think others should know
what that means.
two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By profession
they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?"
For that era of low diversity compared to today, that was an
extremely varied group so it does demonstrate Masonic
tolerance and lack of discrimination on a scale that beats
almost anything else available in that era.
It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
/quote
Yep. That's another of your interests that doesn't matter on
ARA.
That was the clincher for me. When the guy at the Supreme Council explained
the political structure as authoritarian and autocratic, I realized for
certain that I was in the wrong place. Stop trying to tell me what to do
here. Go back to your protected domain if you want to boss people around.
|
Time to get it all out in the open I see...
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
....
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning
(Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art thou cut
down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
FFF
Dirk
http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
http://www.theconsensus.org/ - A UK political party
http://www.onetribe.me.uk/wordpress/?cat=5 - Our podcasts on weird stuff |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Attuarii
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:54 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
| Quote: | Attuarii wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it
would provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI
domination. The more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize
it is anything but that.
At lodge anyone who wishes in their heart for JCI domination gets
it. Anyone who doesn't doesn't. You, being a conspiracy theory
lunatic, clearly wish for it. So what, all that does is identify you
as a lunatic.
Sure are a lot of lions of Judea, Hebrew inscriptions from the Bible,
Keys of Solomon, etc.
Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews,
That's a hot topic for you. It has little relevance in an Asatru
context - Judaism is a folkish faith that happens to be
monotheist. Important to learn from if you have folkish
inclinations but largely ignored by those who do have folksih
inclinations.
Actually, I posted here because you are SR, and I think others should
know what that means.
two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and
varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By
profession they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?"
For that era of low diversity compared to today, that was an
extremely varied group so it does demonstrate Masonic
tolerance and lack of discrimination on a scale that beats
almost anything else available in that era.
It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
/quote
Yep. That's another of your interests that doesn't matter on
ARA.
That was the clincher for me. When the guy at the Supreme Council
explained the political structure as authoritarian and autocratic, I
realized for
certain that I was in the wrong place. Stop trying to tell me what to do
here. Go back to your protected domain if you want to boss people
around.
Time to get it all out in the open I see...
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning
(Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art thou cut
down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
FFF
Dirk
|
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter. I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have been
generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the Temple, the
headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, Southern
Jurisdiction, U.S.A. (http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a
marvelous structure. The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Doug Freyburger
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:10 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
| Quote: | Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning
(Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art thou cut
down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
|
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
| Quote: | Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
|
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
| Quote: | I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
|
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
| Quote: | I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have been
generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the Temple, the
headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, Southern
Jurisdiction, U.S.A. (http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a
marvelous structure. The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
|
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material. |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Attuarii
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:21 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Doug Freyburger wrote:
| Quote: | Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the
morning (Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art
thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have
been generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the
Temple, the headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction, U.S.A.
(http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a marvelous structure.
The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
|
Yes, I went there last week.
| Quote: | Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material.
|
It is undeniable that Masonry draws heavily from biblical themes.
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:24 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Attuarii wrote:
| Quote: | Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the
morning (Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art
thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have
been generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the
Temple, the headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction, U.S.A.
(http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a marvelous structure.
The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
Yes, I went there last week.
Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material.
It is undeniable that Masonry draws heavily from biblical themes.
|
They are really Satanists For Jesus.
FFF
Dirk
http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
http://www.theconsensus.org/ - A UK political party
http://www.onetribe.me.uk/wordpress/?cat=5 - Our podcasts on weird stuff |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Neolithic
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 3:27 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:25:28 -0400, Attuarii <chattengau@germania.sup>
wrote:
| Quote: | I had originally begun looking into Freemasonry because I thought it would
provide some kind of community structure divorced from JCI domination. The
more I learn about the fraternity, the more I realize it is anything but
that. I have recently been investigating the Scottish Rite.
This is one tidbit others might find interesting.
quote
http://www.scottishritecalifornia.org/founding_fathers.htm
As we consider the beginnings of the Scottish Rite, we must wonder also
about these eleven men who took it upon themselves to formalize a Supreme
Council. What were their names, where did they come from, and what
happened later in their lives? Of course, there isn't time to delve very
far into those matters at this time. But, I do want to list their names
with a few facts as follows:
bullet
JOHN MITCHELL - Received a patent April 2 1795, from Barend Moses Spitzer
granting him authority as Deputy Inspector General to create a Lodge of
Perfection and several Councils and Chapters wherever such Lodges or
Chapters were needed.
Born in Ireland in l741, he came to America at an early age, was Deputy
Quartermaster General in the Continental Army, and the first Grand
Commander of the Supreme Council.
bullet
FREDERICK DALCHO - A physician. He served in the Army and for a while was
stationed at Fort Johnson. He formed a partnership with Dr. Isaac Auld,
another of the original members, in 1801. He was an outstanding orator and
author. In 1807 he published the 1st Edition of Ahiman Rezon. He became
an editor of the Charleston Courier, was a lay reader and deacon in the
Episcopal Church and in 1818 was ordained a Priest.
bullet
ALEXANDER FRANCOIS AUGUSTE deGRASSE TILLY - A son of a French Admiral, and
perhaps the most famously connected of all the original eleven. He was the
youngest of the members and was named to become the Grand Commander of the
West Indian Islands. He later moved to France and established the Supreme
Council of France.
bullet
JEAN BAPTISTE MARIE DeLAHOGUE - He was a native of Paris and was a member of
LaCandeur Lodge in Charleston.
bullet
THOMAS BARTHOLOMEW BOWEN - Was the first Grand Master of Ceremonies of the
new Supreme Council. He was a Major in the Continental Army and a printer
by trade.
bullet
ABRAHAM ALEXANDER - Was one of the first Sovereign Grand Inspectors General.
He was born in London in 1743, immigrated to Charleston in 1771. He was a
very prominent Jew and had been described as "a Calligraphist of the first
order," which may account for his election as the first Grand Secretary
General.
bullet
EMANUEL DE LA MATTA - A Sovereign Grand Inspector General. He was by trade
a merchant and auctioneer. He was a member of Friendship Lodge and was
reported to be quite devoted to the study of Jewish Literature and Masonic
Study.
bullet
ISAAC AULD - An eminent physician, associated in medical practice with Dr.
Dalcho. He was a rigid Congregationalist.
bullet
ISRAEL DE LIEBEN - A Sovereign Grand Inspector General and the first Grand
Treasurer General. He was born in Prague and emigrated to America upon
reaching Majority age. He was known as "the liberal-headed Jew," who
was "tolerant in his religious opinions and was considered to be
intelligent, enterprising, liberal and generous.
bullet
MOSES CLAVA LEVY - Was born in Krakow, Poland. He was a prosperous
merchant, was generous and helpful to the unfortunate and devoted to his
adopted city and country.
bullet
JAMES MOULTRIE - Was the only native South Carolinian among the original
members. He was a Doctor of Medicine, and according to Albert Pike, "was
one of the foremost Citizens of South Carolina."
Back to Top
Yes, it was an unusual group, all possessing a strong religious
heritage. Four were Jews, two were from Scotland, two from Ireland, two
were Frenchmen and one was a German. Each representing a rich and varied
background. The four who were Jews were from different countries and
reflected quite different upbringing in religious matters. By profession
they were soldiers, physicians, merchants and one was a
clergyman.
Pike summarized the founding fathers in this manner: "When and where
has there ever been exhibited a more striking proof of the strength and
value of Masonic brotherhood?" It is interesting to note this group lacked
but one to equal the number of the Apostles, yet it included no Judas.
/quote
|
And what was else was Pike?
Neolithic |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Neolithic
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
On Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:24:42 +0100, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
<dirk.bruere@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Attuarii wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the
morning (Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art
thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have
been generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the
Temple, the headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction, U.S.A.
(http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a marvelous structure.
The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
Yes, I went there last week.
Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material.
It is undeniable that Masonry draws heavily from biblical themes.
They are really Satanists For Jesus.
|
Luciferians for Lucifer is more like it.
Neolithic |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Doug Freyburger
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:32 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Neolithic <neolithicnos...@email.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
And what was else was Pike?
|
Very big on religious freedom for his place and era. Not
compared to today but perspectives have changed in the
intervening time.
A cavalry officer on the losing side of the US Civil War and
as such unable to have any goverment activities after the
war. I think it's the main reason he was so active in the
Scottish Rite optional branch of Masonry - He wanted a
civic activity that was beneficial to society as a whole and
at the same time non-political. Wanting a civic activity
that's non-political is near the top of my list of reasons for
joing Masonry as well so some perspectives don't change
over time.
Having read some of his writings he was far more verbose
than I am, an impressive achievement. ;^) And he was a
lot nuttier than I am though not as nutty as Steven.
Rumors that he was among the founders of the Klan do
appear to be just that - rumors. I'd like to think he wasn't
but I think confirming that would be as impossible as
confirming the rumors. |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:32 am Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
Neolithic wrote:
| Quote: | On Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:24:42 +0100, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
dirk.bruere@gmail.com> wrote:
Attuarii wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the
morning (Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art
thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have
been generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the
Temple, the headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction, U.S.A.
(http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a marvelous structure.
The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
Yes, I went there last week.
Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material.
It is undeniable that Masonry draws heavily from biblical themes.
They are really Satanists For Jesus.
Luciferians for Lucifer is more like it.
|
I don't have a problem with that.
If I was defining within that mythology I'd be a Luciferian.
FFF
Dirk
http://www.transcendence.me.uk/ - Transcendence UK
http://www.theconsensus.org/ - A UK political party
http://www.onetribe.me.uk/wordpress/?cat=5 - Our podcasts on weird stuff |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
Neolithic
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 2:10 pm Post subject: Re: Founding Fathers of the Scottish Rite |
|
|
On Sat, 02 Aug 2008 00:32:28 +0100, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
<dirk.bruere@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Neolithic wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:24:42 +0100, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
dirk.bruere@gmail.com> wrote:
Attuarii wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:
Attuarii <chatten...@germania.sup> wrote:
Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/32nd_degree_ritual.htm
"32nd degree ritual from the Authentic Scottish Rite Ritual"
...
"From the freemason's own high level ritual we see MITRA identified and
defined:
MITRA -- The fire, the dawn, the morning star. (Lucifer, not Yeshua or
Jesus, is the god of freemasonry)
Make no mistake about it freemasonry is Mithraism, the worship of
Mithra, which is one of the many names of Lucifer or Satan the devil.
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the
morning (Lucifer usurps Yeshua's title of the morning star)! how art
thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AGNI is another part of the freemason's Ineffable Word.
From the 32nd degree ritual we are informed of AGNI who was borrowed
from the Hindu worship of Lucifer or Mithra before the Persians named
him Mitra. AGNI, INDRA, and VISHNU: Fire, Light, and Heat, the first
trinity and their manifestation in the skies. The interpretations of
these symbols will reveal the Holy Doctrine. The one great idea from
which they have been unfolded is the Royal Secret."
Having been through two difference 32nd degrees in two
different jurisdictions that's not part of either.
Of course, it gets worse the more one googles using keywords like
Jewish, Nazi, occult, Lucifer, Satan, KKK etc etc
In other words it's typical misdirection by kooks. Check,
sure is.
I actually went to the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite to get my
information. They did have a copy of the Zend Avesta on the alter.
Note that English Masonry dates from 1717 and the Scottish
Rite in the US dates from the early 1800s with extensive
rewrites in the late 1800s after the US Civil War when
former citizens in the rebel states no longer had the option
of civic activities so they focused on Masonry. Note that in
that era being open to friendship with members of more than
one protestant denomination would be viewed as expressing
support for freedom of religion and being friends with catholics
would have been viewed as taking freedom of religion to an
extreme. Scottish Rite altars have king james, kenach,
koran, zend avesta and sometimes even a lotus sutra on
them. For the era the degrees were written this was religious
freedom taken far beyond the ken of most individuals. Yes,
to us in Asatru in 2008 CE it seems pretty provincial now,
but not when taken in context.
I've
enjoyed my visits to the Masonic sites around DC, and the people have
been generous with their time, and quite cordial. The House of the
Temple, the headquarters building of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction, U.S.A.
(http://scottishrite.org/visitors/vtour.html), is a marvelous structure.
The pipe organ in the Temple Room blew me away.
There's also the George Washington Masonic Memorial
building were several lodges meet. I expect to participate
in a travelling degree demonstration there next May and I
figure I'll tour the SR building during my optional time.
Yes, I went there last week.
Trying to find an Asatru correlation. Normally anti-Masonic
stuff like the above is cited by kooks who think Masonry is
not Christian enough and here's Attuarii complaining that
it's too Christian. Plus sa change, plus sa mem chose.
It's too much like kooks finding some sort of non-Asatru
storm front web page and then making up a lie that Asatru
is neo-nazi because some neo-nazi idiots try to mimic our
material.
It is undeniable that Masonry draws heavily from biblical themes.
They are really Satanists For Jesus.
Luciferians for Lucifer is more like it.
I don't have a problem with that.
If I was defining within that mythology I'd be a Luciferian.
|
There you go eh?
There's food for thought.
Neolithic |
|
| |
|
| Back to top |
|
