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Reluctant Messenger
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 Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2003 12:57 pm Post subject: God Talking To You |
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God Talking To You
Please don't focus on the individual or the medium delivering this
message; it only gets in the way of our connection. Focus on the
message. If it seems like nonsense to you, that's perfect, your most
likely approach will be to ridicule it. That's ok, it's the built in
mechanism imbedded in the message to prevent those who aren't ready
for it from waking up prematurely .
You've been asking for this for a long time. So don't be surprised
you get it. That is the first thing you need to learn about
communicating with God. If you limit yourself to allowing the
communication to express itself only through certain channels then you
miss some. Sometimes it's the urge to take the back road instead of
the highway that you ignore. A few minutes later you wish you had
heeded the urge because the traffic is snarled due to a major
accident. So don't ignore this message. It's actually difficult to
get anyone to listen to me, let alone write it all down.
You have a lot of questions and I have all the answers but you have to
understand, since I know everything, my difficulty lies in picking the
essentials you need to know.
Of course you want to know why I allow suffering. And I'll get to who
I am soon enough. But rather than deal with each question separately,
I will give the highlights so you can experience the "aha" of solving
the paradoxes in your mind yourself.
Who is God? In other words, who am I? The question could be phrased
better. Who are we? They are all the same question. Once you
understand why these three questions are all the same question you
will have your answer.
If you have read this far without the nonsense-circuit kicking in then
you are ready for the next step. You and I have always existed. We
have always existed. We always will exist. The only unknown is how
much suffering can we avoid?
Why is there suffering? Why is there pain, war and the host of other
evils present in this world? It was unavoidable when we agreed to the
game. Where we come from there is no evil nor is there any goodness.
Where we come from it is neither small nor large, big nor little, dark
nor light. There is no goodness, no evil, no suffering, no happiness.
Our true origin is that which is not created. We are the uncreate and
the uncreate is where we come from. It is our source.
We created the game we call reality. It is the opposite of our true
nature. It is composed of a balance of forces for the purpose of
play. Let me put it this way. God is an experience junky. I am an
experience junky. We are experience junkies. You are an experience
junky. You are the part of me that agreed to leave the void to have
experiences on my behalf. Remember? Nothingness and the bliss of
non-duality got boring? We've played this game over a quadrillion
times.
For those of you unable to handle pure unadulterated truth, the next
few statements should be considered as nonsense or as heresy. Once
again, I'm cutting to the chase. The messenger I'm using is seldom
this receptive so I'm going to cut to the chase. I don't know how
long I can keep this connection. Last time I got this close to
revealing the truth he went to the bathroom and when he got back he
checked his e-mail and I had lost the opportunity.
You are God. Not all of God but the part of God that agreed to enter
the game of experience, reality if you will. You knew the risks
involved but you also knew the risk would be limited to a few trillion
years or so before you came back. You also agreed to forget where you
came from so you could enjoy the thrill of discovering who you really
are.
I have to be brief, I don't have much more time before he checks his
email again. How is all this possible? Why are there so many
religions? Why is there war if we are all God? I'll give several
examples in case one is more effective than the others. Take your
computer for example. When they first came out they were single
tasking machines. Later operating systems were created to allow the
computer to run several programs at once. In order to achieve this,
the program was given the illusion that it had control of all of the
computer when in fact it is just one of possible thousands of programs
using the computer. Just as the program is unaware of the other
programs, you are unaware that you are part of the greater whole.
(God is a workable term for the greater whole.) If you are reading
this on a Mac or a Windows machine, you can use the analogy of
windows. Every window you open on your computer screen is like a part
of the computer unaware of the others. Other programs are aware of
all other programs. If you hit Control Alt Delete on a Windows
machine you can access the part of the computer that sees all the
other programs. God is like that. Only God is the operating system,
the hardware, the individual programs and all the drivers, etc…
Let's try another approach. When you dream, are there other
characters in the dream besides yourself? They do whatever they
should, as is appropriate to the dream situation, yet never let on
that they are really you, performing whatever task your
sub-consciousness has dreamed up. The part of you that is awareness,
your consciousness, is unaware it has fragmented into multiple
personalities for the dream reality. Have you ever dreamed, yet were
aware you were dreaming? Ever controlled the dream once you were
aware you controlled the reality you were in? What if you told the
other individuals in your dream that they weren't real but were really
you. Try it, the individuals in the dream will insist they are
actually real and don't be surprised if some are indignant when you
suggest they are part of a dream.
Ok, here is the next level of nonsense that is actually true. You are
a character in my dream that will participate in the dream world until
you decide to wake up. It's that simple. You can join me anytime you
want to by waking up. Buddha woke up and joined me. Enoch woke up
and joined me.
Lets discuss Jesus Christ since it is the Christmas Season. I have
reserved a part of myself that is like the program you can call up on
a windows machine using Control-Alt-Delete. That part of me has
access to all of the programs running in God Dream World, Our Dream
World. Whenever necessary the Christ Program manifests within the
dream, within the duality based reality, composed of illusion, and do
what is necessary to keep the rest of God on track towards the end.
Mind you, the end is still trillions of years away. If I can maintain
this link longer I will give you more on that later. History has
recorded three manifestation of the Control Program at work. The
Hindus called it Krishna. The ancient mystics were aware of the
Control Program and called him Melchizedek. The Hebrews also call him
YHWH. The most recent manifestation of the Control Program was known
as Yeshua the Anointed One. Later the Roman Empire renamed Yeshua the
Christ to be Son of Zeus (The Head Roman God) Son of Zeus in English
sounds like Jesus. Jesus, Yeshua, Melchizedek, Krishna, they are all
the same; the control program showing up every 2,000 years or so to
keep the overall program on track. Think of Jesus as your big brother
in control of the program governing illusion.
Let's get back to the truly big picture that concerns us. You will be
unaware of your true divinity until you are able to see past the ego
for what it is. The ego is the part of God that creates the illusion
of separateness. The reason for the illusion is because you are the
part of god still addicted to experience. So when the age of
non-duality ends and the illusion world is allowed to expand, you are
the part of God that agrees to leave the boredom of the void and enter
the world of experience. The illusion will unfold over about 64
trillion years. The part of you that leaves oneness and infinity to
plunge into the illusion of separateness and to partake in the
illusion of the finite agrees to be bound by the laws of duality.
Some call it Karma, others call it the law of God. Cause and effect:
Once God has shed infinite awareness and takes on limited awareness
that part of God is bound by cause and effect all the way to the end.
Sometimes the Control Program has to show up and intervene to prevent
a build up of negative karma in the dream of God.
Let me discuss Illusion while the link is holding. In the part of US
(God) that is permanent, there is nothing. No movement, no opposite.
There is neither stillness nor movement. On the other hand, the
created illusion is all about movement. Without getting too
technical, the part of me known as Science is in the process of
figuring out the illusion down to the most paradoxical parts. I can
explain it but I need to give you some truths to absorb before I get
to the part that will help you the most. Later, meditate on these
truths because I don' have time to elaborate on them but none the
less they are true. Nonsense disguised as truth is still nonsense.
Truth disguised as nonsense is still truth.
Truth One: In the created realm there is no such thing as stillness.
Truth Two: In the Created realm everything has an opposite.
Everything is made up of a balance of forces. Not all force is
physical. Hate and Love are forces manifesting as opposite ways of
life.
Truth Three: The Created realm is a participation realm and all
participants are joint creators and destroyers.
Truth Four: All of reality is actually an impermanent pattern
changing and morphing into a reality created by the participants.
Truth Five: Everything that has a beginning has an end.
What scientists want to know:
Time is an illusion, there is only now. How it works is based on a
simple principal. Constant movement towards a prearranged pattern.
At the smallest unit of matter science has found vibrating strings.
These ordinate in the void as light and sound. Vibration is the most
sophisticated simple form of movement. Ever complex patterns can all
originate from simple patterns. Mathematicians discovered this truth
among the Mandelbrot fractal geometries.
Reality is actually composed of a complex pattern moving through a ten
dimensional hyper-sphere. It's not a single pattern but it is all of
the possible patterns in an infinite number of realities. Scientist
have determined a paradox imbedded within Quantum Reality. It appears
that the future creates the present instead of the past creating the
present. Just as paradoxically the present creates the past.
Scientist have also discovered another paradox imbedded within
reality. It appears that all vibrations at the extremely small end of
reality don't actually exist unless observed. Unobserved they are
probability waves and manifest by existing in all vibration states of
probability simultaneously. In effect they have discovered our
secret. How did we create a reality that appears to be finite and
limited when in fact we are infinite and unlimited?
It's important you get this part of the message.
You are God vibrating within a pattern of possibilities. Its takes
some 64 trillion years, to use a phrase you can comprehend, for all of
the possible patterns to play out. But we have put in some controls
based on what we have learned in past epochs when we played this game.
This game of creating an expanse of illusion and having it finally
dissipate back into the void has occurred trillions of quadrillions of
time. Each time the pattern has been more complex. After 64 trillion
years of exploring the possibilities within the patterns we abandon
the realm of experience and digest, so to speak, what we learned over
the last 64 trillion years and compare that to the previous billion or
so games. Then we use the new information to plan the next 64
trillion year game.
The game is played within a ten dimensional hyper-sphere that contains
every possible pattern already created from the previous games. Every
disaster, every heroic deed, every possible good deed and every
possible perversion all exist inside the ten dimensional
hyper-spheres. The hyper-sphere exists within the unmanifest realm.
This realm is devoid of consciousness or awareness. At the center of
the hyper sphere is the entry point, for lack of a better word, for
awareness units. Awareness units consist of an "I am" viewpoint.
When an awareness unit enters the 10 dimensional hypersphere of
infinite possibilities it sheds awareness of its connection to the
infinite and begins a journey that ends with it once again shedding
its I am-ness and rejoining the infinite awareness, losing nothing but
gaining all. The possible occurs when decisions or choices are made.
Our actions and our choices cause the unmanifest to become the
manifest.
Over the course of eternity, our entry and exit into the 10
dimensional sphere of experience is like going down a water slide.
But for God the journey is like a bolt of lightening down a trillion
waterslides. How does this explain the future creating the present
and the present creating the past? Actually it is modeled quite well
using one of the static electricity generators within a large glass
globe. The globe with the dancing purple static electricity
represents all possible experience paths. The lightening within the
ball is the actual paths taken by the awareness units traversing the
shared realities. Think of God's Hand outside the 10 dimensional
hyper-sphere of all possible experience. Where God's hand touches the
outside boundary it causes a bias within the infinite possibilities,
causing the most ideal of all infinite possibilities to be lit like
lightening between the entry point and the exit points. We are still
dealing with an infinite number of paths but that is what the Control
Program does. It prevents awareness points from getting lost within
the infinite possibilities. Right now, there is a guy on LSD playing
with his Van de Graaf Generator who is getting it right now with a
mind blowing wow of total divine understanding. He is GOD and knows
everything and wonders how he got stuck in such a tiny body. Trouble
is, tomorrow he will have forgotten his connection with everything and
his ride on the lightening bolt of GOD MEMORY. He will go on to be
fascinated by electricity and become an electrical engineer but I
digress. Before I lose my link entirely, it has held up much longer
than I expected this time, lets discuss heaven and hell.
Heaven and Hell:
Since you and I have agreed to play the experience game based on the
rules of cause and effect, the 10 dimensional hyper-sphere of
experience is based on cause and effect regardless of what level you
achieve. The most positive and wonderful patterns of vibration are
found in the heavenly realms. The most negative and perverse patterns
are found in the hell realms. As both heaven and hell are found in
the middle, there will come a time when there will be no middle
ground. Both the violent and the peaceful will have their way. At
the appointed time, all "I am" units vibrating peacefully will be
given the opportunity to manifest in a realm where peace and happiness
is the predominate pattern that is further enhanced by the creative
energies of the participants. Also at the appointed time those "I am"
units that vibrate to the violent and the perverse will be given the
opportunity to manifest in a realm where violence and the suffering it
produces is the predominate pattern. Its destructive and perverse
reality will be further warped and intensified by the "I am" units
that revel in darkness. Because these realities are filled with
destruction and war, they frequently burn and smolder. The cycle of
life and death is very short in the hell realms. In the heavenly
realms the cycle of life and birth is extended into the millions and
billions and even trillions of years.
Regardless of whether your path will be among the pleasantries of
heaven or the atrocities of hell, the vibrational pattern you are
establishing in your life today, and the lives that will follow, will
determine whether you play out the next 64 trillion years in the
positive creative splendor of the peace realms or the negative
destructive ugliness of the violent realms.
The thing that must be understood: those that want violence will get
it. It's the way of cause and effect within the experience realm.
Those that want peace and happiness will get that also. Within the
next 1,000 years the Control Program will decide which realm the "I
am" units under his control will go. The decision to send "I am"
units toward the infinite pleasures of heaven or the infinite
sufferings of hell is based totally on the vibrational pattern
established by the previous lives preceding the day of decision.
Regardless of which realm you chose to spend the next 64 trillion
years or so, there will be suffering. There is very little suffering
in the heavenly realms, and the suffering can be intense in the hell
realms, thus the constant escape into death. But in the long run
The only way to escape suffering is to leave the "I am" behind and
rejoin me in the void. But I know you. Regardless of when you rejoin
me, after about 64 trillion years of absolutely no new experiences at
all, you will want to start over in the new 10 dimensional
hyper-sphere of experience. I know it and you know it after all, we
are experience junkies. It's in our nature to explore the
possibilities. I'm losing my link. Yep, there he goes, he checking
his email. I just hope he remembers to send this out.
God, over and out.
A Service of The Reluctant Messenger
-------
The world's religions and science are
pieces to a puzzle that need one another
to achieve a complete picture.
http://www.reluctant-messenger.com/main.htm
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Colin Hankin
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:14 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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In message <f9ee37a4.0312092257.3a225c3a@posting.google.com>, Reluctant
Messenger <zenflow@yahoo.com> writes
| Quote: | God, over and out.
Hello God, |
Very entertaining!
Just one small point.
I was led to believe that the void was bliss.
I think its unlikely that anyone could get bored with it.
TTFN
Colin Hankin www.zenprime.demon.co.uk
email - zendan(at)zenprime(dot)demon(dot)co(dot)uk |
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tiresias
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 8:28 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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Colin Hankin > Hello God,
| Quote: | Very entertaining!
Just one small point.
I was led to believe that the void was bliss.
I think its unlikely that anyone could get bored with it.
TTFN
T---sheep can be led to the slaughterhouse |
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Reluctant Messenger
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 12:12 pm Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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tiresiasz@hotmail.com (tiresias) wrote in message news:<4bf49ee1.0312121828.6872a764@posting.google.com>...
| Quote: | Colin Hankin > Hello God,
Very entertaining!
Just one small point.
I was led to believe that the void was bliss.
I think its unlikely that anyone could get bored with it.
TTFN
T---sheep can be led to the slaughterhouse
|
Try non-moving non-still bliss in the void a googleplex of years
raised to the googleplex. Try no experiences for that long and you
will build a 10 dimensional experience hyper-sphere for a 64 trillion
year long vacation. Once you build the first one its a matter of a
few trillion years of bliss that you'll build another one. Its a real
habit for us now |
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Colin Hankin
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2003 2:45 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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In message <f9ee37a4.0312132212.3ee58f25@posting.google.com>, Reluctant
Messenger <zenflow@yahoo.com> writes
| Quote: | tiresiasz@hotmail.com (tiresias) wrote in message news:<4bf49ee1.0312
121828.6872a764@posting.google.com>...
Colin Hankin > Hello God,
Very entertaining!
Just one small point.
I was led to believe that the void was bliss.
I think its unlikely that anyone could get bored with it.
TTFN
T---sheep can be led to the slaughterhouse
Try non-moving non-still bliss in the void a googleplex of years
raised to the googleplex. Try no experiences for that long and you
will build a 10 dimensional experience hyper-sphere for a 64 trillion
year long vacation. Once you build the first one its a matter of a
few trillion years of bliss that you'll build another one. Its a real
habit for us now
Hello God, |
But you have the experience of perpetual bliss in the void!
How can you forsake that?
All human endeavour is dedicated to producing a pale shadow of what you
experience in perpetuity.
If I were you I would forget the hyper-sphere.
But if I were you I would do a *lot* of things differently.
TTFN
--
Colin Hankin www.zenprime.demon.co.uk
email - zendan(at)zenprime(dot)demon(dot)co(dot)uk |
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godzilla
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:35 pm Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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| Quote: | .......
the possible patterns in an infinite number of realities. Scientist
have determined a paradox imbedded within Quantum Reality. It appears
that the future creates the present instead of the past creating the
present. Just as paradoxically the present creates the past.
........
waterslides. How does this explain the future creating the present
and the present creating the past? Actually it is modeled quite well
using one of the static electricity generators within a large glass
globe. The globe with the dancing purple static electricity
represents all possible experience paths. The lightening within the
ball is the actual paths taken by the awareness units traversing the
shared realities. Think of God's Hand outside the 10 dimensional
hyper-sphere of all possible experience. Where God's hand touches the
outside boundary it causes a bias within the infinite possibilities,
causing the most ideal of all infinite possibilities to be lit like
lightening between the entry point and the exit points. We are still
dealing with an infinite number of paths but that is what the Control
...........
Heaven and Hell:
..........
Regardless of whether your path will be among the pleasantries of
heaven or the atrocities of hell, the vibrational pattern you are
establishing in your life today, and the lives that will follow, will
determine whether you play out the next 64 trillion years in the
positive creative splendor of the peace realms or the negative
destructive ugliness of the violent realms.
|
Oy! Paradox!: presently creating my future? Thought the future was
creating the present. ;-| |
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Nuvoadam
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 6:23 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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| Quote: | Let's try another approach. When you dream, are there other
characters in the dream besides yourself? They do whatever they
should, as is appropriate to the dream situation, yet never let on
that they are really you, performing whatever task your
sub-consciousness has dreamed up. The part of you that is awareness,
your consciousness, is unaware it has fragmented into multiple
personalities for the dream reality. Have you ever dreamed, yet were
aware you were dreaming? Ever controlled the dream once you were
aware you controlled the reality you were in? What if you told the
other individuals in your dream that they weren't real but were really
you. Try it, the individuals in the dream will insist they are
actually real and don't be surprised if some are indignant when you
suggest they are part of a dream.
|
What if one of the characters in the dreamers dream put two and two
together and "woke up" to realize that it was a phantasm, an illusion,
an ephemeral aethereal nuance of mind and light, a puff of smoke in a
hall of mirrors surrounded by shadow, pierced by light.
You imagine telling others they too are illusions, a dream of this being
we call the Universe. Within Gnosticism there is this theme of each one
of us being a potential universe. As the existentialists say-- each
one of us is Brahma when we close our eyes to confront the darkness and
mentally shout "KA?!?" (Who Am I?). It is only by diligent seeking that
Brahma finds the Universe (Vishnu) **reflected** within him, thereby
uniting with each other in a pillar of light generally called Shiva:
triune mind existing in time-space (Brahma), in all time-space associated
with a universe (Vishnu) and within all time-space associated with all
universes and all realities everywhere (Shiva).
So really, the newsflash is that we each of us are potential universes.
And the concept of the unbroken chain goes a little something like this--
if we have an altercation with another being, and thereafter wish them
ill-will (70 X 7 etc.), since we have a microcosmic reflection of this
situation or one similar to it within represented within us, we as the
'sleeping god' thereafte dole out punishment upon this other being (say,
a disliked boss or co-worker) within us. So for the being we are
punishing within us, we are the Demiurge, doling out our Karmic reward
and punishment.
Forgive your enemies. Imagine them living in universe within your
body, a magickal reflection of the one you live in, only with
variations and differences. When you are "asleep", as Jesus and the
Gnostics would say, you are subconsciously ruling over your eminant
domain. You are the *ignorant Demiurge. When you are *awake, you
are ruling over your domain with knowledge of your relationship to
it, if not a discriminating eye for the minutia of each blade of
grass or grain of sand on each planet in every galaxy within your
body.
If you are on the path of love, you forgive all who have offended
or hurt you. Stop punishing them within you, and the way opens up
without. They should, and I stress that word-- should, take it easy
on you in this reality. It is all a case of circular logic, as in
what-goes-around-comes-around.
You are in someones body. Reflections of you are within many
reflections of many bodies. You are living in many different
timelines, exploring many different alternate realities,
converging, diverging, and all the while the real *you--
which is all of these shimmering chains of branched-lightning
_at once_, is growing, becoming full of experience.
Within esoteric lore there is the legend of the chain-of-fools.
These are the unawakened, and they are subject to the laws of
Karmic judgement for this and thus shackled to chains of many
types of suffering, including rebirth. Contrasted to this is
the legend of the unbroken-chain. Each *link* in this chain
is an Aeon. Now it comes to the real nitty-gritty-- what,
exactly is an Aeon?
From the Greek word Zooeon, (Zoo = Zodiac Year), an Aeon of
around 2100+ years, 12 of which made up a Great Year. This
Aeon was divided up into smaller Aeons, 2 of over a thousand
each and then finally into 4 smaller ones of around 525 years
each. A thousand year epoch? Similar to the many legends of
a "thousand year king" perhaps (Norway, Persian etc). And
what of the 500+ year epoch? Is this not the 500 years of
the Egyptian Phoenix mentioned by Herodotus? Is it not the
Aeonic time deliniating the return of the Buddha to Earth?
Each Aeon was *ruled over by a single ruler, and they had
the throne until they screwed it up or lost it in an unjust
coup. And this ruler not only ruled over a vast universal
domain, but they ruled over a meta (beyond) physical one too.
They were the center of the great universal dance, so to speak.
If we are to define what this connection is, we call it the
Pleroma-- the "fullness" of God-mind. No matter where in the
entire Cosmos a being is when they enter the mental realm,
if they are to seek source they will have to pass through a
series of *gateways within themselves, each
magickally connected to another *gateway. Each place, ruled
over by an Archon, is the same place in a different time.
In our spirit form we navigate this path, traveling back and
forth through time to reach one or another Aeon. If one
does not wish to stay in an Aeon ruled over by an Archon
they do not like, they only have to keep traveling until
they find what they are looking for. Question is, what are
you looking for?
Ultimate source? How do you wish to percieve it? There are
Aeons where all is light, mind, thought and you dream blissful
dreams. But wait, aren't you dreaming now? There are many
other Aeons. You are living in one now, which is to say,
you live on this planet earth, in 2003, in a universe which
is contained within the body of a being. The Gnostics claim
he is called Sama-el, which would make his counterpart in
Hebrew lore as a lower doppleganger, characterizing his part
to the best of his ability.
The Sumerians had a god named Samash, which the Hebrews called
Samjasha-el. Like all of their gods, Samael had his signs,
heraldry and iconography, with the sun being given as his
primary symbol. Samash was a sun rising between two mountains,
represented by the Hebrews as the word Ra: an evil vortex or
funnel threatening to suck down the souls of the dead clinging
to the sides of the pit (Sheol aka Hell).
The Gnostics claim that Sophia was represented by a higher
being and a lower form, who acted out the wishes of her
higher form within this reality. Here she has had many
names, including Asherah, Nin-Harsag, Demeter, Isis, Ino,
and etc. Time and time again, Demeter (the meter) gives
birth to her own father Chronos, also called Dionysus aka
Bachas aka Iasus or Jasus. Jesus. What was I on about
again? Universes giving birth to universes. Each within
each other. That is the real nature of the Demiurge within
the Demiurge. Same for the Abraxas within the Abraxas.
The rooster represents the dawning of intelligence after the
dark night of ego. The whip denotes, as the Hermetic Gnostics
say-- you are now a co-equal God with all others, which may
at other times be called *morning stars. You are a ruler
over the Universe, but you rule not just that one without
you, but that within. You are now an Archon, guarding your
own *gate, that being your own mind.
You are a universe within a universe, unawakened to your true
diamond nature. |
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Reluctant Messenger
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 1:31 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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Colin Hankin <chankin@zenprime.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:<Pi8dGNAC2h3$EwuA@zenprime.demon.co.uk>...
| Quote: | In message <f9ee37a4.0312132212.3ee58f25@posting.google.com>, Reluctant
Messenger <zenflow@yahoo.com> writes
tiresiasz@hotmail.com (tiresias) wrote in message news:<4bf49ee1.0312
121828.6872a764@posting.google.com>...
Colin Hankin > Hello God,
Very entertaining!
Just one small point.
I was led to believe that the void was bliss.
I think its unlikely that anyone could get bored with it.
TTFN
T---sheep can be led to the slaughterhouse
Try non-moving non-still bliss in the void a googleplex of years
raised to the googleplex. Try no experiences for that long and you
will build a 10 dimensional experience hyper-sphere for a 64 trillion
year long vacation. Once you build the first one its a matter of a
few trillion years of bliss that you'll build another one. Its a real
habit for us now
Hello God,
But you have the experience of perpetual bliss in the void!
How can you forsake that?
All human endeavour is dedicated to producing a pale shadow of what you
experience in perpetuity.
If I were you I would forget the hyper-sphere.
But if I were you I would do a *lot* of things differently.
TTFN
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Actually, you are me, and you didn't do anything different, otherwise
you wouldn't be in the hypersphere of experience right now. If you
are in a hurry to rejoin your greater self in the bliss, practice your
meditation daily. |
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jetgraphics
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| Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2003 6:27 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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"Against boredom even the gods contend..."
All the suffering, pain, and turmoil of Earthly life is but one aspect of
avoiding the boredom of eternal bliss. It's no wonder souls are seeking
incarnation...
Reluctant Messenger wrote:
| Quote: | God Talking To You
snipped |
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penitent leper
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2003 7:00 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 19:27:16 -0500, jetgraphics
<jetgraphics@no_spamcharter.net> wrote:
| Quote: | "Against boredom even the gods contend..."
All the suffering, pain, and turmoil of Earthly life is but one aspect of
avoiding the boredom of eternal bliss. It's no wonder souls are seeking
incarnation...
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Indeed. Those ignorant, bored Jewish children who were burned in
Auschwitz cuz they wanted to avoid bliss. Perhaps they were
incarnating spirits who would rather have been displaced, deported,
tortured and murdered by Nazis than stay united to the One. Either
way, it makes these victims and the One look like morons.
- pl - |
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jetgraphics
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2003 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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penitent leper wrote:
| Quote: | On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 19:27:16 -0500, jetgraphics
jetgraphics@no_spamcharter.net> wrote:
"Against boredom even the gods contend..."
All the suffering, pain, and turmoil of Earthly life is but one aspect of
avoiding the boredom of eternal bliss. It's no wonder souls are seeking
incarnation...
Indeed. Those ignorant, bored Jewish children who were burned in
Auschwitz cuz they wanted to avoid bliss.
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Don't be narrow minded and forget all those who suffered BY Jewish hands
across time. I suspect there's some Philistines and Canaanites who are
outraged, as well.
| Quote: | Perhaps they were
incarnating spirits who would rather have been displaced, deported,
tortured and murdered by Nazis than stay united to the One.
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Who told you that they were united with the One BEFORE incarnation?
| Quote: | Either
way, it makes these victims and the One look like morons.
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I must dismiss your objection. The person inflicting the pain and suffering
is not "the One". The person experiencing the pain and suffering is not
"the One". And the consequences of their acts aren't the responsibility of
"the One". The participants suffer the consequences, good or bad.
Foreknowledge of the spirit is not foreknowledge of the conscious mind.
If the "oversoul" is "all-knowing" and the unit souls have an inkling of
"what's up", then, yes, souls DO know what's coming. And if there is a
choice to incarnate, then it IS a decision to experience the whole gamut of
possibilities.
Consider a paraplegic, who cannot "feel" anymore. Wouldn't a paraplegic
gladly embrace the pain as well as the pleasure of feeling? That there is
pain and suffering is not a condemnation upon all experience. And if
bliss in the spirit realm is numbness devoid of feeling, incarnation into
even the most horrid state may be more desirable.
If there is no spirit, no foreknowledge, and nothing but oblivion at death,
then it's a different scenario. Law of the jungle rules, and live live live
till you don't.
What's your belief? |
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penitent leper
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:10 pm Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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On Tue, 30 Dec 2003 09:33:42 -0500, jetgraphics
<jetgraphics@no_spamcharter.net> wrote:
| Quote: | penitent leper wrote:
On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 19:27:16 -0500, jetgraphics
jetgraphics@no_spamcharter.net> wrote:
"Against boredom even the gods contend..."
All the suffering, pain, and turmoil of Earthly life is but one aspect of
avoiding the boredom of eternal bliss. It's no wonder souls are seeking
incarnation...
Indeed. Those ignorant, bored Jewish children who were burned in
Auschwitz cuz they wanted to avoid bliss.
Don't be narrow minded and forget all those who suffered BY Jewish hands
across time. I suspect there's some Philistines and Canaanites who are
outraged, as well.
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Don't be narrow minded and forget that the Jews are only one example
of all who suffer. Any example would suffice but I used the Holocaust
as an obvious case. The "outrage" of Philistines and Canaanites that
you mention is part and parcel of the Holocaust outrage and the
outrage associated with every other crime.
| Quote: | Perhaps they were
incarnating spirits who would rather have been displaced, deported,
tortured and murdered by Nazis than stay united to the One.
Who told you that they were united with the One BEFORE incarnation?
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You stated that suffering is avoidance of "the boredom of eternal
bliss". Whether that bliss is a future or a past state is irrelevant
to the fact that your claim imputes masochism to sufferers.
If they weren't united with the One before incarnation; or even if
they _were_ united - no matter.
Your claim is that they create their sufferings in order to avoid
eternal bliss, which is one facet of unity with the One. Therefore
you impute boredom to the state of being united with the One.
| Quote: | Either
way, it makes these victims and the One look like morons.
I must dismiss your objection. The person inflicting the pain and suffering
is not "the One".
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Sure it's the One - in sadomasochistic codependence with the
"deliberately, foreknowing, reincarnating spirits" - which both
creates and participates in the universal pain game.
| Quote: | The person experiencing the pain and suffering is not
"the One".
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According to Hinduism it is: the One is caught up in its own "Lila",
the "play" of Its own creation. And we are but temporarily
self-forgetting fragments of the One, the vehicles through which It
experiences the world.
| Quote: | And the consequences of their acts aren't the responsibility of
"the One". The participants suffer the consequences, good or bad.
Foreknowledge of the spirit is not foreknowledge of the conscious mind.
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It still makes the victims and the One look like morons. The
victims choose their idiotic fates, and the One manifests Itself as a
sadistic creator and masochistic participant.
| Quote: | If the "oversoul" is "all-knowing" and the unit souls have an inkling of
"what's up", then, yes, souls DO know what's coming. And if there is a
choice to incarnate, then it IS a decision to experience the whole gamut of
possibilities.
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And if that's true, souls are masochistic morons. If the souls
"have an inkling and DO know what's coming", then 1) they're
masochists, and 2) they cannot possibly expect "to experience the
WHOLE gamut of possibilities" - because the possibilities are limited
by the very choice of fates.
Instead of opting-out of this trashy world, these spirits of yours
continue to reincarnate, and worse, they deliberately choose an
incarnation in which they will be tortured by Nazis, invaded by the
Bush administration, enslaved by Romans, wiped out by the Black Death,
be raped and murdered while children, etc. Morons, indeed.
| Quote: | Consider a paraplegic, who cannot "feel" anymore. Wouldn't a paraplegic
gladly embrace the pain as well as the pleasure of feeling?
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Perhaps - if s/he is an unregenerate, degraded lunatic. The better
choice - if such exists - would be to realize oneself as spirit and
drop conditioned existence, including the ape body - paraplegic or not
- that humans so unfortunately inhabit.
| Quote: | That there is
pain and suffering is not a condemnation upon all experience.
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Of course it is. There can be no worse condemnation.
| Quote: | And if
bliss in the spirit realm is numbness devoid of feeling, incarnation into
even the most horrid state may be more desirable.
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I know of no system but yours which claims that the spirit realm is
"numbness devoid of feeling." You claimed that people create their
sufferings in order to avoid the "boredom" of eternal bliss with the
One. It is therefore you, not me, who is claiming that "the spirit
realm is numbness and devoid of feeling" and needs to be avoided by
creating suffering-games.
| Quote: | If there is no spirit, no foreknowledge, and nothing but oblivion at death,
then it's a different scenario.
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Incarnating with foreknowledge of being tortured by Nazis or made
Palestinian refugees by Israelis is a goofy scenario indeed. In any
event, the categories of spirit and immortality are not dependent on
your masochistic reincarnation scenario.
| Quote: | Law of the jungle rules, and live live live
till you don't.
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The law of the jungle rules as long as your purported spirits are
stupid and masochistic enough to reincarnate in meat bodies. Until
they educate themselves out of their need for masochism, the
delusional need to immortalize themselves through DNA progeny, and the
illusionary quest for nerve-end stimulation, they can only be
described as putzes, losers and suckers. All organic bodies are parts
of, and function to support, "the jungle" - they are bundles of
selfish-gene-supporting autonomic systems designed only to keep the
organism alive long enough to generate descendents. If other
organisms stand in the way of this program, "war" is declared. War is
biology. Reincarnating spirits, if such exist, are apparently too
dull to understand these basic facts about wordly existence in bodies.
There are no spiritual or enlightened bodies. Bodies are mindless
cycles of force and are opposed to spirit. If spirits realized this
simple, stark truth, they would drop the reincarnation game. Not
that I believe in reincarnation, of course. I'm just using it as an
example.
snip
- pl - |
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jetgraphics
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 5:37 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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penitent leper wrote:
| Quote: | There are no spiritual or enlightened bodies. Bodies are mindless
cycles of force and are opposed to spirit. If spirits realized this
simple, stark truth, they would drop the reincarnation game. Not
that I believe in reincarnation, of course. I'm just using it as an
example.
- pl - |
So why bother arguing for a point you neither accept nor defend? |
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penitent leper
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 8:50 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 18:37:54 -0500, jetgraphics
<jetgraphics@no_spamcharter.net> wrote:
| Quote: | penitent leper wrote:
There are no spiritual or enlightened bodies. Bodies are mindless
cycles of force and are opposed to spirit. If spirits realized this
simple, stark truth, they would drop the reincarnation game. Not
that I believe in reincarnation, of course. I'm just using it as an
example.
- pl -
So why bother arguing for a point you neither accept nor defend?
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I argue for the point of spirit. I don't argue for reincarnation,
but addressed it nonetheless because the poster to whom I was replying
raised such issues. Hence to those like the poster believe in
reincarnation I argue for the point of a spirit which, if realized,
would drop the reincarnation game.
- pl - |
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Judy Stein
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 10:32 am Post subject: Re: God Talking To You |
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penitent leper <bastaschs@peak.org> wrote in message news:<2dj1vv050dm945te6vjduibnegn3tks13t@4ax.com>...
<snip>
| Quote: | Indeed. Those ignorant, bored Jewish children who were burned in
Auschwitz cuz they wanted to avoid bliss. Perhaps they were
incarnating spirits who would rather have been displaced, deported,
tortured and murdered by Nazis than stay united to the One. Either
way, it makes these victims and the One look like morons.
|
Why do you assume these spirits are united to the One prior
to their incarnation?
There's a school of thought that maintains spirits can *only* become
united to the One through repeated human incarnation, which is why,
obviously, they would incarnate.
In between incarnations, prior to final liberation (Unity with the
One), spirits are said to exist on a plane that doesn't involve the
kind of suffering one experiences during incarnation, but it doesn't
involve unity with the One either, according to this school of
thought. "Heaven," in other words, is nice, but it's short of
Nirvana. |
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