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 Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 8:05 am Post subject: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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cindys
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e55dfvkndf9nshtabccgsijtqnhrnh2e3k@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:55:14 GMT, "cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com
wrote:
Because the torah was given to Jews. Only Jews are obligated to follow
the
laws of the torah.
Sorry Cindy. The Gentiles are obligated to follow the 7
Noachide Laws in the Torah (as well as the Jews, who have an
additional 606 commandments to practice).
------------- |
What I meant was that gentiles are not obligated to follow the 613 mitzvos.
I have posted this on countless occasions.
Best regards,
---Cindy S |
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cindys
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:qn4dfv0g31revkj0torbaaj6qj24ihp0n7@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:51:02 -0400, "Caiaphas"
Caiaphas66@hotmail.com> wrote:
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:DY1qa.1978$o47.773@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
How does this differ when you state that Jews who practice a religion
other
than Judaism "loses his place in the World to Come"?
That depends if the other religion is idolatrous or not. For
example, Judaism has the LEAST in common with Christianity (because it
practices idolatry), more in common with Islam (because it
acknowledges one INCORPOREAL G-D), and the MOST in common with Buddism
(because of a parallel philosophy up to a point).
----------- |
Buddhism is an atheistic religion. Judaism is ethical monotheism. I can't
see where the two have very much in common at all.
Best regards,
---Cindy S. |
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JW
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 10:48 am Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:51:02 -0400, "Caiaphas"
<Caiaphas66@hotmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:DY1qa.1978$o47.773@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
How does this differ when you state that Jews who practice a religion other
than Judaism "loses his place in the World to Come"?
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That depends if the other religion is idolatrous or not. For
example, Judaism has the LEAST in common with Christianity (because it
practices idolatry), more in common with Islam (because it
acknowledges one INCORPOREAL G-D), and the MOST in common with Buddism
(because of a parallel philosophy up to a point).
| Quote: | From the Jewish perspective, why is a Jew condemned for practicing
Christianity, when a Gentile is not condemned for practicing Christianity?
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Gentiles ARE condemned for practicing Christianity. They are
also not permitted to worship idols. The Torah specifically has the 7
Noachide commandments for everyone (Jew and Gentile alike) to
practice.
JW |
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Raymond
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 1:15 pm Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e55dfvkndf9nshtabccgsijtqnhrnh2e3k@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:55:14 GMT, "cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com
wrote:
Because the torah was given to Jews. Only Jews are obligated to follow
the
laws of the torah.
Sorry Cindy. The Gentiles are obligated to follow the 7
Noachide Laws in the Torah (as well as the Jews, who have an
additional 606 commandments to practice).
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The Gentiles are not requied to follow any of the laws in the Torah, not a
one. That is why they are not Jews.
| Quote: |
The laws of the torah are not binding on gentiles, so
they are not condemned for not keeping them.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
Yes they (the Gentiles) ARE obligated by the Torah. The Torah
was given for all mankind (accepted by the Jews without question) The
Jews (the people chosen by G-D )are supposed to be the role models and
teachers of the Torah's precepts to the world.
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You do not know what your talking about. The Torah was given to the Israel
and not one else, and it doesn't matter what the Jews accept or don't, like
they say, the don't follow the Christian teachings as it is not for them,
neither is the laws of the Old, for mankind. They are role models, who do
you think Israel got all the Idols that King Saul and others set up. Not
good role models but just the same role models, if we go by them, be a king
and have a thousand wife's. Make golden images, get G-d made and maybe He
would end all the world. If it was up to the Jews to be role models they
missed that before they even knew they were suppose to be such.
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Raymond
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 1:16 pm Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:M7uJa.92893$zm1.56979@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
| Quote: |
"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e55dfvkndf9nshtabccgsijtqnhrnh2e3k@4ax.com...
On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:55:14 GMT, "cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com
wrote:
Because the torah was given to Jews. Only Jews are obligated to follow
the
laws of the torah.
Sorry Cindy. The Gentiles are obligated to follow the 7
Noachide Laws in the Torah (as well as the Jews, who have an
additional 606 commandments to practice).
-------------
What I meant was that gentiles are not obligated to follow the 613
mitzvos. |
How many gentiles even know of such laws, and how many care? You follow
them, they don't have to.
| Quote: | I have posted this on countless occasions.
Best regards,
---Cindy S
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Caiaphas
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"Raymond" <NOSPAM-rwknapp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bd6d20$lh37@rain.i-cable.com...
| Quote: |
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:M7uJa.92893$zm1.56979@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e55dfvkndf9nshtabccgsijtqnhrnh2e3k@4ax.com...
On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:55:14 GMT, "cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com
wrote:
Because the torah was given to Jews. Only Jews are obligated to follow
the
laws of the torah.
Sorry Cindy. The Gentiles are obligated to follow the 7
Noachide Laws in the Torah (as well as the Jews, who have an
additional 606 commandments to practice).
-------------
What I meant was that gentiles are not obligated to follow the 613
mitzvos.
How many gentiles even know of such laws, and how many care? You follow
them, they don't have to.
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All this about the 613 mitzvos and the Noahide Laws is ancient stuff that has
been superceeded with the arrival of Christ. Read your New Testament,
Christians.
Christians today are NOT obligated to obey the Law of Moses -- just the laws and
messages that Christ endorsed and elaborated on for us. We live in the glories
of the NEW COVENANT!!!! A time of Grace without the condemnation of the Law. |
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Caiaphas
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: When the New Testament is fully understood, who would ev |
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"Susan Cohen" <flaviaR@his.com> wrote in message
news:3ef3512e_5@vienna7.his.com...
| Quote: |
"Marc" <whoami_noreply@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a3b8ce1c.0306191639.50d7eb09@posting.google.com...
What an incredible liar you are!
Susan
Hello !
Uh, I do believe telling someone to bugger off by saying "why don't
you go and prosyletise elsewhere. How about an Islamic ng for a
change.........that should be real fun" sounds pretty anti-Muslim to
me...
Then you miss the point of what we are trying to tell the bigots who
proselytize here.
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I call it debating. You want to say its to Proselytize when you can't debate it
further.
So who decides what is Proselytizing?
And who decided that Proselytizing was not allowed here?
Personally, I think it is a cop out when folks holler 'thats anti-Semitic', or
'thats proselytizing'. Most likely its just a way to muzzle debate. |
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Caiaphas
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 3:53 pm Post subject: Re: When the New Testament is fully understood, who would ev |
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"Tilly" <climbaboard@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:IoRIa.42240$JA5.744792@news.xtra.co.nz...
| Quote: | Marc wrote:
snipped
Apologies Tilly : I seem to have been mistaken...
I appreciate your apology..thanks...
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Marc, I would not apologize for what you said. I agree with you in that Tilly
is anti-Arab. |
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Caiaphas
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 3:57 pm Post subject: Re: Has God ever talked to you with the clarity that old Sam |
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"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:gV1Ha.46027$zm1.30762@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
| Quote: |
"Caiaphas" <Caiaphas66@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ds4Ga.161$Qe1.5806@eagle.america.net...
History has been changed so many times by each government that is in the
rule, it be a wonder if any history is correct. Then what is the
truth, I
didn't say a word about denying anything, did I? I only said it is
over,
and nothing we can do is going to change that, so who cares today what
happen back then in history. It has nothing to do with today. People
see
history from where they wanted to. Saddan said he won the war and
defeated
the USA at the gulf war.
People make History say what they want it to. I don't see any thing
new
about the Crusades, it was not nice as the gulf war and the two short
wars
the USA just won was. Then why would they be contrary to the Will of
God?
Do you not believe as the bible says, nothing can happen without Gods
approval? That God has all the nations of the world under his hand, and
puts in to power and removes from power whom He wants?
Well Raymond, we can learn from the Crusades and understand that
mainstream
thinking, even mainstream Christian thinking, can lead one to think they
are
doing Gods Will when in truth we are committing sins.
Obviously whatever happened was God's will or He wouldn't have allowed it to
happen. Or perhaps you believe that God's powers are limited. Of course, in
the world of Caiaphas, the ultimate decisor of what is "God's will" and who
is "committing a sin" is Caiaphas.
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Gods will is to give man free will to do His Will. Now the question is whether
the way modern-day Israel was brought about was by doing Gods Will. The way the
Scriptures are revealed to me is that modern-day Israel is *not* Gods Will.
That is *not* anti-Semitic - its just my revelation.
| Quote: |
Yes, the Crowd Mentality
is prevelant in Christian thinking.
Whether you believe that the Crusades happened as generally perceived or
whether
you believe writers of history distorted the truth is not as great as
learning
from this story and applying it to our lives.
The last Gulf War is another matter - I personally did not see a valid
reason
Other people did see a valid reason, but in the world of Caiaphas, his
*opinion* is the only valid one.
for it and it is becoming apparent that it should not have occurred.
"Apparent" to you perhaps.
Regarding whether God directs every event, we just do not know. Some of
us
believe that God gave man free-will and freedom to either do good or do
evil.
You can say, no one is predestined to be evil or predestined to be good.
Instead, we have free-will to choose to either do good or do evil.
And I don't know of any Jew (or Christian) that would deny that we were
given free will. If we didn't have free will, what would be the point of
rewarding the righteous yet punishing the wicked?
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
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Caiaphas
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Has God ever talked to you with the clarity that old Sam |
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"JW" <hotairheads2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:m952fv4ooguka69kgg5dc57b5ucbmjvg3c@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Mon, 26 May 2003 16:52:24 -0400, "Caiaphas"
Caiaphas66@hotmail.com> wrote:
Points to ponder:
- Did God *really* command this?
Yes. Jews and Righteous Gentiles believe in G-D, and that the
Torah is the Divine Revelation.
- Is this historically correct?
Yes. The Torah is consistent with historical reality; much of
it denied by Jew-hating Gentiles, because they want to undermine the
legitimacy of Judaism.
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I didn't undermine the legitimacy of Judaism - God did. That is my revelation
from reading the Bible. Read the Bible.
| Quote: |
- Do you really believe the character of God is such that He really
did have a whole people wiped out?
Yes. Because the Amalekites attacked the Jews for no reason
and wanted to destroy them. Amalek represents the antithesis of
everything the Torah stands for.
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I see it differently. Samuel stated that Saul was to destroy all the Amalek
including women, children, infants, and their animals.
Sounds more like plain old human revenge instead of a command from God.
| Quote: |
- Could it be that the Israelites really did do this deed, but just
did it in Gods name and God really did not 'command' it?
No. That kind of behaviour TYPICALLY describes Arab Moslems.
They preach peace and practice MURDER.
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One could make the case that the ancient Israelites were a blood-thirsty bunch
too.
| Quote: |
- Is the character of God revealed here is contrary to God in the New
Testament?
The character of G-D (if one can say such a thing), is
accurately described in the Torah, to wit: G-d is incorporeal and
absolutely perfect. All his deeds are good and merciful (even if we
don't see it).
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Course, true Christians believe that the character of God is more completely
revealed by the revelation given to us by Jesus Christ. |
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Tilly
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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Caiaphas wrote:
| Quote: | The way I read the Bible is that the ancient Israelites and Jews
failed God and that was the reason He brought us the New Covenant for
all mankind without a separation of man from God nor a difference of
Jew or Gentile. It says in the Bible that there no longer is a Jew
and a Gentile. Instead, if we embrace Christ then we are his chosen
people.
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-Does the way you read things make you feel better about yourself?
Tilly
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climbaboard@hotmail.com |
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Jim F.
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: the sole obstacle to peace in the Middle East for the pa |
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"Tilly" <climbaboard@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:iIBJa.46167$JA5.804546@news.xtra.co.nz...
| Quote: | Caiaphas wrote:
Well, Tilly, your posts imply that you are anti-Christian.
I am not anti-Jews as individuals -- just anti those things that are
against Christ.
LOL........I am not in the least anti Christian.
I think you are an arrogant know all, who actually knows very little.
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Caiphas loves Jews as long as they are Christians.
Jim F.
| Quote: |
Tilly
--
climbaboard@hotmail.com
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cindys
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:15 pm Post subject: Re: Has God ever talked to you with the clarity that old Sam |
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"Caiaphas" <Caiaphas66@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:H2BJa.425$IP6.20800@eagle.america.net...
| Quote: |
Gods will is to give man free will to do His Will. Now the question is
whether
the way modern-day Israel was brought about was by doing Gods Will. The
way the
Scriptures are revealed to me is that modern-day Israel is *not* Gods
Will.
That is *not* anti-Semitic - its just my revelation.
------------
It must be so wonderful for you that God *reveals the Scriptures* to you |
personally and has given you the gift of *revelation.*
Best regards,
---Cindy S. |
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Caiaphas
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 8:40 pm Post subject: Re: Who is the ANTICHRIST? |
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"Tilly" <climbaboard@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:BLBJa.46174$JA5.804473@news.xtra.co.nz...
| Quote: | Caiaphas wrote:
The way I read the Bible is that the ancient Israelites and Jews
failed God and that was the reason He brought us the New Covenant for
all mankind without a separation of man from God nor a difference of
Jew or Gentile. It says in the Bible that there no longer is a Jew
and a Gentile. Instead, if we embrace Christ then we are his chosen
people.
-Does the way you read things make you feel better about yourself?
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Yes |
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